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Why scientist and other people are unable to understand the concept of Spirituality?
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E-mailMade Popular Dec 15 2008
India :
The reasons why scientist and other people are unable to understand the concept of Spirituality are :
1. The domain of scientist is only physical world while the spirituality is spread much beyond the physical world.
2. Scientist make observations through the senses which are for outward objects like eyes, ears, nose etc. While spirituality requires development of inner senses to see the glory of HIS Creation.
It requires true devotion to the Lord and sacrifice from the objects of the world to develop inner senses.
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1.ya, but it also requires for evolution?
2.The soul develops or understands the materiel things only through the outward objects (ear, nose, tongue,skin and eye)
so all this created by God with some aim. I think all this help the soul to evolve.
2.The soul develops or understands the materiel things only through the outward objects (ear, nose, tongue,skin and eye)
so all this created by God with some aim. I think all this help the soul to evolve.
(Local Perspectives)
When we want to see the spiritual world, we have to open our internal senses. Which is beyond the scope of physical world, the domain of scientists.
(Local Perspectives)
The outre senses give us information and knowledge about the physical world but the inner sneses help us explore the spiritual world.
(Local Perspectives)
Spirituality and scientific approach can go hand in hand but the tools for the two are different.
(Global Perspectives)
Scientist feel that there is everything what we see, they can prove with the logic. But there are so many things happening and they are not able to prove.
The big bang, the first happening of this creation is still to be proved on the basis of some theory.
The gist is, we can feel the effect of so many phenomenon but to prove it requires knowledge equal to that of the creator of the universe.
The big bang, the first happening of this creation is still to be proved on the basis of some theory.
The gist is, we can feel the effect of so many phenomenon but to prove it requires knowledge equal to that of the creator of the universe.
(Local Perspectives)
Very true. But how many of us know this and believe in it?
Problem here is lack of knowledge and belief.
Problem here is lack of knowledge and belief.
(Local Perspectives)
Scientist can understand sprituality better than any other person if they comply-
1. Think their brain as processor
2. Follow the instructions carefully and religiously without fails or 0 deviation, here instructions are bachans told by master(Guru who have already mastered the mind)
3. Remove bugs or virus(Wishes, anger, ahnkar) these bugs are only known by company of Guru which is called satsang
4. After knowing their bugs and virus try hard to remove them,
5. when they have removed all bugs and virus they will find ultimately chitta( which called soul)
6. Chitta is kind of wave which rember GOD all time which is called sumiran
Run the scan virus every morning and evening devote their chitta in lotus feet of Guru which is source of Soul
It is easy if scientist try that way
1. Think their brain as processor
2. Follow the instructions carefully and religiously without fails or 0 deviation, here instructions are bachans told by master(Guru who have already mastered the mind)
3. Remove bugs or virus(Wishes, anger, ahnkar) these bugs are only known by company of Guru which is called satsang
4. After knowing their bugs and virus try hard to remove them,
5. when they have removed all bugs and virus they will find ultimately chitta( which called soul)
6. Chitta is kind of wave which rember GOD all time which is called sumiran
Run the scan virus every morning and evening devote their chitta in lotus feet of Guru which is source of Soul
It is easy if scientist try that way
(Local Perspectives)
Very true, But problem is that they do not think like that.
(Local Perspectives)
Problem of science is limitations of physical sensors.
(Global Perspectives)
spirituality begins where logic ends
logic leads to doubt
a child never questions if his mother is really his mother he knows
but swami sivananda was a doctor of medicine so it depends on destiny & grace of god
logic leads to doubt
a child never questions if his mother is really his mother he knows
but swami sivananda was a doctor of medicine so it depends on destiny & grace of god
(Local Perspectives)
That is called the destiny, which is based on our previous karams. Not every scientist is a non spiritual person. But definitely those who are not blessed with HIS grace, apply logic and thus fail to understand the spirituality.
(Local Perspectives)
To be spiritual one needs to surrender and clean his heart and mind.
(Local Perspectives)
There is logic in spirituality also but our spirit can only understand that.
(Global Perspectives)
I would add, if I were asked to edit, one word to your article’s title... Why do some scientists.... ?
Because science leads some to spirituality. Allow me to relate a few examples, of which I am personally aware.
First myself: I am a trained scientist/engineer; this is also my natural tendency. My studies did not include anything of a spiritual vein but a scientist is seeking truth and an engineer is trying to make use of the precieved order of the universe. Ask a student of science a question and he will bore you with detailed answers. Ask a scientist, who has specialized in a field the same question and he is likely to say, ”I don’t know.” This ”I don’t know” point is the border between physical and spiritual. I was fortunate to have J Krishnamurti as a friend. He was always awed by anyone with a scientific education. As we walked and talked, I explained reality from an engineer’s viewpoint and he shared his views. There was always a meeting point.
Secondly: In one of Krishnamurti’s essays, he explained that the observer was the observed. When the quantum physicists Bohr, Böhm, and others read this, they knew he understood their science, as a result of his spiritual quests and they flocked to him for explanations.
Thirdly: Brahmananda Sarswati, deceased head of the Saraswati order, also known as Dr Ramurti Mishra, endocrinologist, cardiologist, pathologist, opthamologist, accupuncturist, ayurvedic physician, Sanskrit scholar, Samhkya Yoga guru. His credentials in Western medicine wer impeccable, as was his fame among the scholars of the Saraswati order.
Paradoxically, Krishnamurti taught me to think and Brahmananda taught me to feel.
I met many scientists at Krishnamurti’s home and Brahmananda’s ashram. everal were Nobel laureates. I’ll describe one, who I know will wish not to be named, as a mathemetician studying chaos theory. Because chaos seems to be a contradiction to the scientific rules of order, he was seeking the fundamental order behind chaos. Whenever he found that order and looked deeper, he found an additional layer of choas, and when he found the order supporting that layer, he found beneath that yet more chaos. He eventually found his way to Brahmananda, who explained Reality.
One sees, when one is ready to see.
Because science leads some to spirituality. Allow me to relate a few examples, of which I am personally aware.
First myself: I am a trained scientist/engineer; this is also my natural tendency. My studies did not include anything of a spiritual vein but a scientist is seeking truth and an engineer is trying to make use of the precieved order of the universe. Ask a student of science a question and he will bore you with detailed answers. Ask a scientist, who has specialized in a field the same question and he is likely to say, ”I don’t know.” This ”I don’t know” point is the border between physical and spiritual. I was fortunate to have J Krishnamurti as a friend. He was always awed by anyone with a scientific education. As we walked and talked, I explained reality from an engineer’s viewpoint and he shared his views. There was always a meeting point.
Secondly: In one of Krishnamurti’s essays, he explained that the observer was the observed. When the quantum physicists Bohr, Böhm, and others read this, they knew he understood their science, as a result of his spiritual quests and they flocked to him for explanations.
Thirdly: Brahmananda Sarswati, deceased head of the Saraswati order, also known as Dr Ramurti Mishra, endocrinologist, cardiologist, pathologist, opthamologist, accupuncturist, ayurvedic physician, Sanskrit scholar, Samhkya Yoga guru. His credentials in Western medicine wer impeccable, as was his fame among the scholars of the Saraswati order.
Paradoxically, Krishnamurti taught me to think and Brahmananda taught me to feel.
I met many scientists at Krishnamurti’s home and Brahmananda’s ashram. everal were Nobel laureates. I’ll describe one, who I know will wish not to be named, as a mathemetician studying chaos theory. Because chaos seems to be a contradiction to the scientific rules of order, he was seeking the fundamental order behind chaos. Whenever he found that order and looked deeper, he found an additional layer of choas, and when he found the order supporting that layer, he found beneath that yet more chaos. He eventually found his way to Brahmananda, who explained Reality.
One sees, when one is ready to see.
(Global Perspectives)
Thanks for the contribution you have made to this topic.
(Local Perspectives)
In thinking about this subject, while driving, I recalled that Albert Einstein was initiated into yoga by Parmahansa Yogananda and Luther Burbank, the founder of modern plant genetics was also a yogi.
(Global Perspectives)
In a way people who are wiser get knowledge of this world as well as true wisdom of total creation.
(Local Perspectives)
It is the learning which one can make in any direction, be it science or spirituality.
(Global Perspectives)
It is the learning which one can make in any direction, be it science or spirituality or both.
(Global Perspectives)
At the end of the day, its all in your brain.
Human brain is so powerful that it can do science-related stuff as well as spiritual stuff. It all about your belief!
Human brain is so powerful that it can do science-related stuff as well as spiritual stuff. It all about your belief!
(Local Perspectives)
It is our heart and the mind which controls our action in any direction.
(Local Perspectives)
Many scientist talk about sprituality. Some look from their telescope and find amazing galaxies, stars etc and praise GOD for such a wonderful creation and says themselves Spritual, some talk with Veda Guru and find similarity in between whats written in Vedas and Modern physics, try to understand reason for creation and say themselves Spritual, Some make their own assumption and hypothesis, make conclusion on their own and call them selves spritual......All these is not at all SPRITIUAL,
Spritualiy is when you engage yourself with GOD through proper practise of MEDITATION, how many scitenist Meditate- i think none, they consider MEDITATION as waste of time.
Spritualiy is when you engage yourself with GOD through proper practise of MEDITATION, how many scitenist Meditate- i think none, they consider MEDITATION as waste of time.
(Local Perspectives)
True, problem is that many people do not know the real meaning and method of spiritual development.
(Local Perspectives)
They would know when they would have a desire to know, when they would consider themselve NONE before GOD,
When they would like to be pure,
A great Saint called Kabir has written beautifully-
Jab mai tha tab HARI nahi, ab HARI hai mai nahi,
Prem gali ati sankari ta me do nahi samani,
Meaning when there was EGO, GOD was not there,
Now GOD is there but EGO is not there.
Way of LOVE is so conjusted that BOTH cant be there.
another beautiful line by same saint-
Moti maya sab taje, jhini taji nai jay
Peer, pagember, auliya sabko jhini khay.
Its easy to be renounced by outer means but lighter eliments such as Ego, Anger and wishes are eating every man who has renounced the world by outer means
IDEALS for sprituality are very high, its not easy to put step on it, because while doing so you have to fight with yourself,
Thats the probable reason for scientis for not steping on that way of spritiuality
When they would like to be pure,
A great Saint called Kabir has written beautifully-
Jab mai tha tab HARI nahi, ab HARI hai mai nahi,
Prem gali ati sankari ta me do nahi samani,
Meaning when there was EGO, GOD was not there,
Now GOD is there but EGO is not there.
Way of LOVE is so conjusted that BOTH cant be there.
another beautiful line by same saint-
Moti maya sab taje, jhini taji nai jay
Peer, pagember, auliya sabko jhini khay.
Its easy to be renounced by outer means but lighter eliments such as Ego, Anger and wishes are eating every man who has renounced the world by outer means
IDEALS for sprituality are very high, its not easy to put step on it, because while doing so you have to fight with yourself,
Thats the probable reason for scientis for not steping on that way of spritiuality
(Local Perspectives)
True, when the time will come, every one will turn to spirituality.
(Local Perspectives)
Very nice article. Thanks for posting Dr Saini!
(Local Perspectives)
Thanks for your kind words. Please read other articles and give your views when you are free.
(Local Perspectives)
Dr. Ratan, thanks for bringing up the topic! Being a non-conventional thinker, I tend to see the issue in a different light. While countless pages may be written in discussion, I’ll strive for brevity here.
First of all, I think that the assertion that scientists are unable to understand spirituality is rather clichéd and not very justified. Even before we start playing with philosophical concepts, it is important to define them operatively. What exactly is ‘spirit’ and what do we mean by ‘spirituality’? In the above posting, you tell that the domain of science is the ‘physical’. So spirit is something not ‘physical’. But what exactly is ‘physical’ then? Is energy (waves, radiation etc.) included in your definition of ‘physical’? If so, then energy IS the domain of science and a core concept of scientific research. So what exactly is ‘non-physical’ or ‘spiritual’? Cognition, emotions, motivation, and many other formerly ‘abstract’ concepts have now scientific basis. Take ‘Devotion to the Lord’, for example, as mentioned in the post. What is it but a feeling or a way of thinking? Can such a feeling or thought exist without a functional brain or a living, physical body? I think not. Religious people believe that it does but that again is a way of thinking, not objective evidence.
Secondly, and also equally important, there is the traditional concept of science relying solely on senses? This approach has a number of weaknesses. Primarily, science does not solely rely on sensory data. Sensory data is the initial stage of acquiring information from/about/on any object or phenomenon. This data is then processed mentally and logical connections are made between various parts of the data in order to derive an inference. So abstract thinking and logic is involved to a great extent in developing a scientific concept, and not only sensory data is used.
More recently, the boundaries between science and spirituality have been diffused by some eminent scientific works, e.g. Dr. Robin Kelly from New Zealand whose seminal work on transmission of cosmic energy by the human DNA has led to the hypothesis of possible remote communication between humans, animals, and other living entities. In effect, it means that telepathy is possible. But is it science or spirituality? DNA, transmission of energy, and receiving and responding to energies are all the domain of science and are quite tangible concepts in science. To me, spirituality is the yet-to-discovered domain of science; once science finds sensory evidence and a good scientific explanation for a phenomenon (usually regarded as spiritual), it becomes science. I think that explains my position on the issue quite expressly.
For those who are interested in reading my interview with Dr. Kelly, published in our print quarterly The Audience Review, please read online in our current issue at http://www.worldaudience.org/pubs_aud_rev_issues.html.
First of all, I think that the assertion that scientists are unable to understand spirituality is rather clichéd and not very justified. Even before we start playing with philosophical concepts, it is important to define them operatively. What exactly is ‘spirit’ and what do we mean by ‘spirituality’? In the above posting, you tell that the domain of science is the ‘physical’. So spirit is something not ‘physical’. But what exactly is ‘physical’ then? Is energy (waves, radiation etc.) included in your definition of ‘physical’? If so, then energy IS the domain of science and a core concept of scientific research. So what exactly is ‘non-physical’ or ‘spiritual’? Cognition, emotions, motivation, and many other formerly ‘abstract’ concepts have now scientific basis. Take ‘Devotion to the Lord’, for example, as mentioned in the post. What is it but a feeling or a way of thinking? Can such a feeling or thought exist without a functional brain or a living, physical body? I think not. Religious people believe that it does but that again is a way of thinking, not objective evidence.
Secondly, and also equally important, there is the traditional concept of science relying solely on senses? This approach has a number of weaknesses. Primarily, science does not solely rely on sensory data. Sensory data is the initial stage of acquiring information from/about/on any object or phenomenon. This data is then processed mentally and logical connections are made between various parts of the data in order to derive an inference. So abstract thinking and logic is involved to a great extent in developing a scientific concept, and not only sensory data is used.
More recently, the boundaries between science and spirituality have been diffused by some eminent scientific works, e.g. Dr. Robin Kelly from New Zealand whose seminal work on transmission of cosmic energy by the human DNA has led to the hypothesis of possible remote communication between humans, animals, and other living entities. In effect, it means that telepathy is possible. But is it science or spirituality? DNA, transmission of energy, and receiving and responding to energies are all the domain of science and are quite tangible concepts in science. To me, spirituality is the yet-to-discovered domain of science; once science finds sensory evidence and a good scientific explanation for a phenomenon (usually regarded as spiritual), it becomes science. I think that explains my position on the issue quite expressly.
For those who are interested in reading my interview with Dr. Kelly, published in our print quarterly The Audience Review, please read online in our current issue at http://www.worldaudience.org/pubs_aud_rev_issues.html.
(Global Perspectives)
Thanks you very much for your kind views.
I do agree with you on many points referred above.
The crux is any one can learn about spirituality provided he is ready to accept some basics.
I do agree with you on many points referred above.
The crux is any one can learn about spirituality provided he is ready to accept some basics.
(Local Perspectives)
I am agree with karim that science demand evidence to prove existence of
some thing be it Spirit or be it a Stone.
How to define Spirit- it can be possible by theory only.
I am taking an example in history of science Newtonian physics consisted of
3 dimensions only later Einstein added fourth dimension called Time
How we define Time, Can you see it- No,
Can you feel it No- its just definitive answers to our daily life, we feel
time passing (But what is passed? did you feel from all senses?) How many
events take place in 1 micro seconds? How many light years it takes to come
light from distance stars?
Idea about time is just our vague feeling, Do time applied at earth for 24
hours is applied every where in universe...therefore idea for light is
derived and its calculated on speed of light.....to come on definitive
answers on Time.
But when you go in modern physics you see all together different picture,
you see there non existence of time, what Buddha has said- Time is like
flame, it is like change of events but from outer perspectives it seems like
flame which is ever changing. It is happening of events which we call time,
Speed of light is a happening of event . We derived time out of it, if there
were no happening of event there wouldn’t have been Time
Now I come to Spirit- we see it daily, we feel it daily like-Time, we call
it conscious, we call it thinking pattern etc.
As said in GITA- Spirit is everlasting it never get finish by any mean, so
our conscious, logics, thinking pattern should also be everlasting if we
considering these -Spirit. But that is not the picture when we go to deep
sleep, trauma, or if Doctor give your chloroform you become unconscious,
then if thinking pattern that you are calling spirit shouldn’t be
unconscious, so these are not spirit.
Now what is spirit, you can consider it another dimension existing in human
body which is everlasting, even if you die it remain existing, Now you would
object i am becoming metaphysical. I am talking out of physics.
I take an example- you eat, you feel by your five senses, you think , you
work you enjoy, you become sad, you become happy, you become gloomy, you
laugh, you cry.
What are all these event? happening differently in different time and
situation?
These are ever changing event that are happening - Called Spirit. Since
your spirit is involved in this matterlistic world it is give all such
expressions- happy, laugh, cry, gloomy, sad, etc.
Lets see you are listening a beautiful song of your choice in Sunday
afternoon, and you are enjoying the day, suddenly news come that your wife
has died- would you continue to enjoy same song that you were enjoying a
moment ago- No, because change has taken place in you mental sphere and you
would cry.
It is because your spirit is involved with your mental sphere called Mind.
It is not easy to detach your spirit from your mental sphere therefore you
keep feeling happiness and sadness,
Many saint like Guru Nanak, Kabir etc has came in different Time and told
people to get detach the spirit from mental sphere. But our mental tendency
is so strong that we wouldn’t cared for what they said.
(Local Perspectives)
I am agree with karim that science demand evidence to prove existence of some thing be it Spirit or be it a Stone.
How to define Spirit- it can be possible by theory only.
I am taking an example in history of science Newtonian physics consisted of 3 dimensions only later Einstein added fourth dimension called Time
How we define Time, Can you see it- No,
Can you feel it No- its just definitive answers to our daily life, we feel time passing (But what is passed? did you feel from all senses?) How many events take place in 1 micro seconds? How many light years it takes to come light from distance stars?
Idea about time is just our vague feeling, Do time applied at earth for 24 hours is applied every where in universe...therefore idea for light is derived and its calculated on speed of light.....to come on definitive answers on Time.
But when you go in modern physics you see all together different picture, you see there non existence of time, what Buddha has said- Time is like flame, it is like change of events but from outer perspectives it seems like flame which is ever changing. It is happening of events which we call time, Speed of light is a happening of event . We derived time out of it, if there were no happening of event there wouldn’t have been Time
Now I come to Spirit- we see it daily, we feel it daily like-Time, we call it conscious, we call it thinking pattern etc.
As said in GITA- Spirit is everlasting it never get finish by any mean, so our conscious, logics, thinking pattern should also be everlasting if we considering these -Spirit. But that is not the picture when we go to deep sleep, trauma, or if Doctor give your chloroform you become unconscious, then if thinking pattern that you are calling spirit shouldn’t be unconscious, so these are not spirit.
Now what is spirit, you can consider it another dimension existing in human body which is everlasting, even if you die it remain existing, Now you would object i am becoming metaphysical. I am talking out of physics.
I take an example- you eat, you feel by your five senses, you think , you work you enjoy, you become sad, you become happy, you become gloomy, you laugh, you cry.
What are all these event? happening differently in different time and situation?
These are ever changing event that are happening - Called Spirit. Since your spirit is involved in this matterlistic world it is give all such expressions- happy, laugh, cry, gloomy, sad, etc.
Lets see you are listening a beautiful song of your choice in Sunday afternoon, and you are enjoying the day, suddenly news come that your wife has died- would you continue to enjoy same song that you were enjoying a moment ago- No, because change has taken place in you mental sphere and you would cry.
It is because your spirit is involved with your mental sphere called Mind. It is not easy to detach your spirit from your mental sphere therefore you keep feeling happiness and sadness,
Many saint like Guru Nanak, Kabir etc has came in different Time and told people to get detach the spirit from mental sphere. But our mental tendency is so strong that we wouldn’t cared for what they said.
How to define Spirit- it can be possible by theory only.
I am taking an example in history of science Newtonian physics consisted of 3 dimensions only later Einstein added fourth dimension called Time
How we define Time, Can you see it- No,
Can you feel it No- its just definitive answers to our daily life, we feel time passing (But what is passed? did you feel from all senses?) How many events take place in 1 micro seconds? How many light years it takes to come light from distance stars?
Idea about time is just our vague feeling, Do time applied at earth for 24 hours is applied every where in universe...therefore idea for light is derived and its calculated on speed of light.....to come on definitive answers on Time.
But when you go in modern physics you see all together different picture, you see there non existence of time, what Buddha has said- Time is like flame, it is like change of events but from outer perspectives it seems like flame which is ever changing. It is happening of events which we call time, Speed of light is a happening of event . We derived time out of it, if there were no happening of event there wouldn’t have been Time
Now I come to Spirit- we see it daily, we feel it daily like-Time, we call it conscious, we call it thinking pattern etc.
As said in GITA- Spirit is everlasting it never get finish by any mean, so our conscious, logics, thinking pattern should also be everlasting if we considering these -Spirit. But that is not the picture when we go to deep sleep, trauma, or if Doctor give your chloroform you become unconscious, then if thinking pattern that you are calling spirit shouldn’t be unconscious, so these are not spirit.
Now what is spirit, you can consider it another dimension existing in human body which is everlasting, even if you die it remain existing, Now you would object i am becoming metaphysical. I am talking out of physics.
I take an example- you eat, you feel by your five senses, you think , you work you enjoy, you become sad, you become happy, you become gloomy, you laugh, you cry.
What are all these event? happening differently in different time and situation?
These are ever changing event that are happening - Called Spirit. Since your spirit is involved in this matterlistic world it is give all such expressions- happy, laugh, cry, gloomy, sad, etc.
Lets see you are listening a beautiful song of your choice in Sunday afternoon, and you are enjoying the day, suddenly news come that your wife has died- would you continue to enjoy same song that you were enjoying a moment ago- No, because change has taken place in you mental sphere and you would cry.
It is because your spirit is involved with your mental sphere called Mind. It is not easy to detach your spirit from your mental sphere therefore you keep feeling happiness and sadness,
Many saint like Guru Nanak, Kabir etc has came in different Time and told people to get detach the spirit from mental sphere. But our mental tendency is so strong that we wouldn’t cared for what they said.
(Local Perspectives)
Any one can get the spiritual experience when he surrender to the true teacher and act as per his guidance.
(Local Perspectives)
Add your Comment
Which I do not find, helping them learn the knowledge of spiritual domain.